Comments on: Can you imagine the attention this would be getting if Daisuke was back with the Lions? http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/ Media, Baseball, Boston, the Red Sox, Music, Literature, and Mnookins Mon, 13 Oct 2008 17:16:35 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: tmurph13 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4237 tmurph13 Thu, 21 Dec 2006 15:39:37 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4237 I think Boras was a bit outplayed by Theo, but emphasis on a bit. I agree that the crowing has been overblown, but I also have no criticism of the Sox front office work in regards to Matsuzaka. I bet that Boras' target was for something shorter than 5 years and more than $10.4 per year. I think he mistepped on the fort knox quote and I think the Sox, to their credit, were in position to read that misstep and how it was playing back in Japan. That probably helped firm up the belief in the leverage they had and let them go back with a reasonable upward adjustment that was still good value to them. In the end, Boras still got a good result for his client given the context, but he also could have gotten a better result if the Soc had slipped up. It will be interesting to see how the posting system changes. It looks to be a crude version of the transfer system used worldwide in soccer. What's interesting is that in that system the agents get paid from the transfer amount and not from the players salary and often the player himself gets a cut. I think Boras was a bit outplayed by Theo, but emphasis on a bit. I agree that the crowing has been overblown, but I also have no criticism of the Sox front office work in regards to Matsuzaka. I bet that Boras’ target was for something shorter than 5 years and more than $10.4 per year. I think he mistepped on the fort knox quote and I think the Sox, to their credit, were in position to read that misstep and how it was playing back in Japan. That probably helped firm up the belief in the leverage they had and let them go back with a reasonable upward adjustment that was still good value to them. In the end, Boras still got a good result for his client given the context, but he also could have gotten a better result if the Soc had slipped up.

It will be interesting to see how the posting system changes. It looks to be a crude version of the transfer system used worldwide in soccer. What’s interesting is that in that system the agents get paid from the transfer amount and not from the players salary and often the player himself gets a cut.

]]> By: unforgiven http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4164 unforgiven Wed, 20 Dec 2006 16:58:39 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4164 Rob Bradford wrote, "Also, the posting price was tax-free, which amounted to another 40 percent or so saved from the $103 million, almost negating the $51-plus million." I wouldn't call that reporting "excellent," Mr. Mnookin. That's just sloppy, if not outright stupid. The tax is not coming "from" the $103m. It's not money recouped, it's money that was never spent, and doesn't in any way negate the posting fee, as Bradford claims. He's gushing. <i>You're being silly. It doesn't negate the $51.1, obviously, but that's a minor slip up that could have been the result of anything -- a weird insertion in copyediting, a sentence that was cut in half, etc...and any reader should be able to figure out what's meant, as opposed to, say, reporting information that doesn't have any basis in reality. If you're going to get offended over things like that, you're going to be pissed a whole lot of the time. -- Seth</i> Rob Bradford wrote, “Also, the posting price was tax-free, which amounted to another 40 percent or so saved from the $103 million, almost negating the $51-plus million.”

I wouldn’t call that reporting “excellent,” Mr. Mnookin. That’s just sloppy, if not outright stupid. The tax is not coming “from” the $103m. It’s not money recouped, it’s money that was never spent, and doesn’t in any way negate the posting fee, as Bradford claims. He’s gushing.

You’re being silly. It doesn’t negate the $51.1, obviously, but that’s a minor slip up that could have been the result of anything — a weird insertion in copyediting, a sentence that was cut in half, etc…and any reader should be able to figure out what’s meant, as opposed to, say, reporting information that doesn’t have any basis in reality. If you’re going to get offended over things like that, you’re going to be pissed a whole lot of the time.

– Seth

]]> By: benschon http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4102 benschon Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:11:34 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4102 The Sox are in the catbird seat on the Drew contract. They have Matsuzaka signed, and now they have a legitimate reason to re-negotiate the terms of a contract that a whole lot of people think was too much money for too many years. This reminds me of making a house sale contingent on an inspection. You can always find something in the inspection report that allows you to return to the seller and say, "I know we agreed on a price, but I didn't realize that the furnace needed to be replaced in a few year. How about we knock 5 grand off the price?" If there are lots of other buyers at the higher price, the seller will tell you to take a hike. But if you overpaid, it's a way to recoup some of the money from your initial mistake. The Sox are in the catbird seat on the Drew contract. They have Matsuzaka signed, and now they have a legitimate reason to re-negotiate the terms of a contract that a whole lot of people think was too much money for too many years.

This reminds me of making a house sale contingent on an inspection. You can always find something in the inspection report that allows you to return to the seller and say, “I know we agreed on a price, but I didn’t realize that the furnace needed to be replaced in a few year. How about we knock 5 grand off the price?” If there are lots of other buyers at the higher price, the seller will tell you to take a hike. But if you overpaid, it’s a way to recoup some of the money from your initial mistake.

]]> By: benschon http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4100 benschon Tue, 19 Dec 2006 19:00:59 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4100 All this crowing about how Theo outplayed Boras is a little absurd. Boras' job is to extract maximum dollars for his client. Considering that he pushed the Sox to their pre-determined maximum spending limit, to the point where they were ready to let the deal collapse, I would say he squeezed out every last dollar. His 5 percent commission on this deal is $2.6 million vs. nothing if the Sox had walked away. What's more, these negotiations drew so much attention to the posting fee system and its problems, the system will probably get reformed anyway. Orza and Selig are already on the record that something should be done. This was his other big priority, which will now happen even though he did not have to do the "nuclear option" of sending Matsuzaka back to the Seibu Lions. In summary, he gets maximum dollars for his client (not as much as Boras' ask, but in how many negotiations does that ever happen?), a huge commission, and the strong likelihood of a reformed system that will earn him even more money in the future. And people are reporting that "lost" this negotiation? Please. All this crowing about how Theo outplayed Boras is a little absurd. Boras’ job is to extract maximum dollars for his client. Considering that he pushed the Sox to their pre-determined maximum spending limit, to the point where they were ready to let the deal collapse, I would say he squeezed out every last dollar. His 5 percent commission on this deal is $2.6 million vs. nothing if the Sox had walked away.

What’s more, these negotiations drew so much attention to the posting fee system and its problems, the system will probably get reformed anyway. Orza and Selig are already on the record that something should be done. This was his other big priority, which will now happen even though he did not have to do the “nuclear option” of sending Matsuzaka back to the Seibu Lions. In summary, he gets maximum dollars for his client (not as much as Boras’ ask, but in how many negotiations does that ever happen?), a huge commission, and the strong likelihood of a reformed system that will earn him even more money in the future. And people are reporting that “lost” this negotiation? Please.

]]> By: Ogie Oglethorpe http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4092 Ogie Oglethorpe Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:47:48 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4092 If they have health questions about Drew reduce the guaranteed portion of the deal replace it with performance incentives. Either that or simply back out. No need to plow forward if you are uncomfortable. If they have health questions about Drew reduce the guaranteed portion of the deal replace it with performance incentives. Either that or simply back out. No need to plow forward if you are uncomfortable.

]]> By: tinisoli http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4090 tinisoli Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:28:27 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4090 The St. Louis-ian calm about this Drew issue may reflect that people are busy with holiday preparations and also that we're all a bit burned out by last week's mania. I know I need a breather. But it also seems clear that few fans would be upset if Drew's shoulder issue compelled the Sox to back out of this deal. The publicity about Drew's medical history makes this less than shocking. I imagine a lot of people expected something to turn up in the physical. Maybe the Sox did, too, and this is just another adaptation in their evolving M.O.: Offer big money, make it seem like a deal is done, but then use the physical's results to force a player (or a team) to make some concessions at the last minute. I don't buy into the theory that the Sox offered a contract to Drew as a way to get Boras in a good mood. The guy is a very rich, powerful, successful agent, not some barfly who'll go home with you if you buy a few drinks. And if his clients suspected that he was pliable, they'd probably fire him. He's got to fight for each guy as if he's the only client he's got. The St. Louis-ian calm about this Drew issue may reflect that people are busy with holiday preparations and also that we’re all a bit burned out by last week’s mania. I know I need a breather. But it also seems clear that few fans would be upset if Drew’s shoulder issue compelled the Sox to back out of this deal. The publicity about Drew’s medical history makes this less than shocking. I imagine a lot of people expected something to turn up in the physical. Maybe the Sox did, too, and this is just another adaptation in their evolving M.O.: Offer big money, make it seem like a deal is done, but then use the physical’s results to force a player (or a team) to make some concessions at the last minute.

I don’t buy into the theory that the Sox offered a contract to Drew as a way to get Boras in a good mood. The guy is a very rich, powerful, successful agent, not some barfly who’ll go home with you if you buy a few drinks. And if his clients suspected that he was pliable, they’d probably fire him. He’s got to fight for each guy as if he’s the only client he’s got.

]]> By: branatical http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4088 branatical Tue, 19 Dec 2006 17:02:10 +0000 http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2006/12/19/can-you-imagine-the-attention-this-would-be-getting-if-daisuke-was-back-with-the-lions/#comment-4088 Not sure if this is a case in point, but the link to Rob Bradford's piece doesn't work. (<i>Should be fixed now...</i>) I'm surprised Murray Chass hasn't come out to say that: now even the Red Sox are so frightened of potential tampering charges, they choose to stoop to new lows to back out of the JD Drew deal. It will be interesting to see how this Drew situation gets resolved. If the deal doesn't get done, conspiracies will certainly fly...Given his potential for physical breakdown, supposed soft make up and outlandish contract, I personally wouldn't be all that upset. I don't want 14 million spending half the time on the DL. Not sure if this is a case in point, but the link to Rob Bradford’s piece doesn’t work. (Should be fixed now…)

I’m surprised Murray Chass hasn’t come out to say that: now even the Red Sox are so frightened of potential tampering charges, they choose to stoop to new lows to back out of the JD Drew deal.

It will be interesting to see how this Drew situation gets resolved. If the deal doesn’t get done, conspiracies will certainly fly…Given his potential for physical breakdown, supposed soft make up and outlandish contract, I personally wouldn’t be all that upset. I don’t want 14 million spending half the time on the DL.

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