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	<title>Comments on: What - you want more on the Mitchell Report?</title>
	<link>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/</link>
	<description>Media, Baseball, Boston, the Red Sox, Music, Literature, and Mnookins</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 20:41:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: SoxCrazy</title>
		<link>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-323718</link>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Dec 2007 08:37:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-323718</guid>
					<description>Seth,

Great way of putting it: &quot;Why, you might ask, would a sure-fire Hall of Famer risk his reputation and legacy over these last five or so years by taking PEDs?&quot; I think that, for most people, that is the worst part of the whole steroid &lt;i&gt;thing&lt;/i&gt;. Somebody who is already living the life that everybody dreams about--playing baseball professionally, getting paid millions, etc--decides they aren't content and wants more.

As for how the Sox got away mostly cleanly, I don't really know what to think. There are a few guys (Ortiz, for example) who I just can't imagine doing steroids or cheating in any way at all. There are those like Gagne, for example, who was described as lacking the proper dedicated mindset to keep himself physically fit and needed the assistance of the steroids. But Pedroia, as quoted in &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.projo.com/redsox/content/sox15_12-15-07_UU89AAQ_v3.45e79a8.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this article&lt;/a&gt;, says he has never heard any whispers about 'roids in the minors or the majors and has never been approached about them. He says the generation made up by him, Jonathan Papelbon, Jacoby Ellsbury, Clay Buchholz, Jon Lester, Brandon Moss, etc will be the &quot;clean generation&quot; who learned from others' mistakes. Let's hope it's so, hmm?

On a rather different note, I'm in the middle of the book &lt;i&gt;Feeding the Monster&lt;/i&gt; and I just wanted to say I'm loving it. The style and information are great, and I especially find it helpful as I began following the Sox just in '03--there wasn't a pre-Werner/Lucchino/Henry era for me!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seth,</p>
<p>Great way of putting it: &#8220;Why, you might ask, would a sure-fire Hall of Famer risk his reputation and legacy over these last five or so years by taking PEDs?&#8221; I think that, for most people, that is the worst part of the whole steroid <i>thing</i>. Somebody who is already living the life that everybody dreams about&#8211;playing baseball professionally, getting paid millions, etc&#8211;decides they aren&#8217;t content and wants more.</p>
<p>As for how the Sox got away mostly cleanly, I don&#8217;t really know what to think. There are a few guys (Ortiz, for example) who I just can&#8217;t imagine doing steroids or cheating in any way at all. There are those like Gagne, for example, who was described as lacking the proper dedicated mindset to keep himself physically fit and needed the assistance of the steroids. But Pedroia, as quoted in <a href="http://www.projo.com/redsox/content/sox15_12-15-07_UU89AAQ_v3.45e79a8.html" rel="nofollow">this article</a>, says he has never heard any whispers about &#8216;roids in the minors or the majors and has never been approached about them. He says the generation made up by him, Jonathan Papelbon, Jacoby Ellsbury, Clay Buchholz, Jon Lester, Brandon Moss, etc will be the &#8220;clean generation&#8221; who learned from others&#8217; mistakes. Let&#8217;s hope it&#8217;s so, hmm?</p>
<p>On a rather different note, I&#8217;m in the middle of the book <i>Feeding the Monster</i> and I just wanted to say I&#8217;m loving it. The style and information are great, and I especially find it helpful as I began following the Sox just in &#8216;03&#8211;there wasn&#8217;t a pre-Werner/Lucchino/Henry era for me!
</p>
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		<title>by: tinisoli</title>
		<link>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-322991</link>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Dec 2007 16:23:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-322991</guid>
					<description>Clemens is A) really really dumb, and B) one of the great egomaniacs of our time. That combination can make it very easy for an accomplished athlete to justify cheating or even convince himself that he's not doing anything wrong. And like everyone has pointed out, once you get a taste of success and you realize that your peers are cheating to get ahead, it's pretty tempting to keep up with them by dabbling in 'roids and HGH yourself. These guys are hyper-competitive, but I don't think we should ever assume that they draw the line at clean, fair competition. 

An annoying meme floating around before and after the Report's release was the &quot;YANKEES GOT NAILED/SOX ARE UNSCATHED&quot; b.s. Shaughnessy peddled it in the next day's Globe, suggesting that Mitchell's place on the Sox masthead must have had something to do with the Yankees getting &quot;trashed&quot; and the world champion Sox emerging untouched. Did anyone do the math? Number of 2007 Sox named in the report: 2. Number of '07 Yankees: 3. It seems that Sox haters think that because the Yankees' juicers were hugely important to their recent teams that Mitchell should have outed players of similar stature from the Sox, just to be &quot;fair.&quot; How bizarre. 

An interesting game to play is to think or look back on magazine articles from '98-'04 about the intense workout regimens of various players. I remember one in particular in Men's Journal about Bonds' routine, including his balms and creams. And who can forget the Nomar cover of SI in '01, or whenever that was? Likewise for Giambi when he was in Oakland (Esquire, I believe). And obviously Clemens has welcomed many a journalist to witness his workouts. Basically, just look back through the archives for the guys who were most eager to show the world that they were bulking up to do hard work in the gym, and you'll probably find some of the biggest juicers around. They must've figured that it was a good way to deflect steroid rumors before they began. 'See? I let the whole world see how hard I lift and how many sprints I run. If I were cheating, why would I do that?'</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clemens is A) really really dumb, and B) one of the great egomaniacs of our time. That combination can make it very easy for an accomplished athlete to justify cheating or even convince himself that he&#8217;s not doing anything wrong. And like everyone has pointed out, once you get a taste of success and you realize that your peers are cheating to get ahead, it&#8217;s pretty tempting to keep up with them by dabbling in &#8216;roids and HGH yourself. These guys are hyper-competitive, but I don&#8217;t think we should ever assume that they draw the line at clean, fair competition. </p>
<p>An annoying meme floating around before and after the Report&#8217;s release was the &#8220;YANKEES GOT NAILED/SOX ARE UNSCATHED&#8221; b.s. Shaughnessy peddled it in the next day&#8217;s Globe, suggesting that Mitchell&#8217;s place on the Sox masthead must have had something to do with the Yankees getting &#8220;trashed&#8221; and the world champion Sox emerging untouched. Did anyone do the math? Number of 2007 Sox named in the report: 2. Number of &#8216;07 Yankees: 3. It seems that Sox haters think that because the Yankees&#8217; juicers were hugely important to their recent teams that Mitchell should have outed players of similar stature from the Sox, just to be &#8220;fair.&#8221; How bizarre. </p>
<p>An interesting game to play is to think or look back on magazine articles from &#8216;98-&#8217;04 about the intense workout regimens of various players. I remember one in particular in Men&#8217;s Journal about Bonds&#8217; routine, including his balms and creams. And who can forget the Nomar cover of SI in &#8216;01, or whenever that was? Likewise for Giambi when he was in Oakland (Esquire, I believe). And obviously Clemens has welcomed many a journalist to witness his workouts. Basically, just look back through the archives for the guys who were most eager to show the world that they were bulking up to do hard work in the gym, and you&#8217;ll probably find some of the biggest juicers around. They must&#8217;ve figured that it was a good way to deflect steroid rumors before they began. &#8216;See? I let the whole world see how hard I lift and how many sprints I run. If I were cheating, why would I do that?&#8217;
</p>
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		<title>by: wired1</title>
		<link>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-321806</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Dec 2007 15:40:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-321806</guid>
					<description>Seth,

THe point about the usual rules not applying to athletes is a good one.  Otherwise, why would they write their own checks and leave a paper trail; there is nothing that many of them have ever faced that would cause them to believe they would have to take responsibility for their actions.  Their lives are based on their ability to perform on the playing field, and athletes are allowed to break rules from high school, through college, and in the pros.

Many are also not the brightest, most educated guys, and perhaps easily influenced by their trainers, who probably care very little about the long term health risks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seth,</p>
<p>THe point about the usual rules not applying to athletes is a good one.  Otherwise, why would they write their own checks and leave a paper trail; there is nothing that many of them have ever faced that would cause them to believe they would have to take responsibility for their actions.  Their lives are based on their ability to perform on the playing field, and athletes are allowed to break rules from high school, through college, and in the pros.</p>
<p>Many are also not the brightest, most educated guys, and perhaps easily influenced by their trainers, who probably care very little about the long term health risks.
</p>
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		<title>by: drew717</title>
		<link>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-321293</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Dec 2007 02:18:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sethmnookin.com/blog/2007/12/13/what-you-want-more-on-the-mitchell-report/#comment-321293</guid>
					<description>&quot;Does that mean that other teams–like, say, the Sox–are (or were) any cleaner? Hell no. It just means no-one else had a clubhouse attended that got popped.&quot;

Exactly.  To me, parts VII through IX read like a detailed indictment, which is interesting to be sure, but it seems as if something with this much pomp, circumstance and hype behind it should be more comprehensive.  It seems disingenuous for the Mitchell Commission to assert that they engaged in a wide-ranging inquiry when the players they point out by name were either out in the open as a result of the BALCO scandal, or were dimed out a couple of trainers.  All these points are probably to anyone with a brain but I fear that the average observer will see this list as the &quot;Who Was Who in Steroids&quot; for the past decade and a half.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Does that mean that other teams–like, say, the Sox–are (or were) any cleaner? Hell no. It just means no-one else had a clubhouse attended that got popped.&#8221;</p>
<p>Exactly.  To me, parts VII through IX read like a detailed indictment, which is interesting to be sure, but it seems as if something with this much pomp, circumstance and hype behind it should be more comprehensive.  It seems disingenuous for the Mitchell Commission to assert that they engaged in a wide-ranging inquiry when the players they point out by name were either out in the open as a result of the BALCO scandal, or were dimed out a couple of trainers.  All these points are probably to anyone with a brain but I fear that the average observer will see this list as the &#8220;Who Was Who in Steroids&#8221; for the past decade and a half.
</p>
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